When you are in a state of complete desirelessness, your heart is as calm as water, with no ulterior motives. You do not seek to acquire information, win the other person's favor, or care about their opinions of you, nor do you even care if there will be another chance to communicate. At this moment, you are most free-spirited, yet still maintain respect for the other person. The rhythm of the conversation can be fast or slow, and the topics can be varied, entirely depending on the preferences of both parties. Occasional silence does not make you feel uneasy, nor do you need to consciously think about what to say next; even when discussing points of disagreement, you do not feel constrained. The dialogue can be interrupted at any time and can also be resumed at any time. This sense of joy does not come from being recognized or conquered, but from the moment when the soul resonates with the world, a sense of satisfaction that "I am the world."