Exclusive Interview with Offchain Labs CEO: Why Did Robinhood Choose Arbitrum?

Organized & Compiled: Deep Tide TechFlow

Guest: Steven Goldfeder, Founder and CEO of Offchain Labs

Host: Laura Shin

Podcast Source: Unchained

Original Title: Why the Arbitrum Stack Won in the Race to Support Robinhood Chain

Release date: July 4, 2025

Summary of Key Points

Steven Goldfeder, the CEO of Offchain Labs, explained why Robinhood chose Arbitrum to rebuild the crypto infrastructure of its core products, the potential that on-chain stock tokenization may bring, and why we might be re-entering the "zero to one" phase of the crypto space.

Steven Goldfeder, co-founder of Offchain Labs, shared on the Unchained podcast why Robinhood chose to rebuild its products based on the Arbitrum technology stack, which signifies the evolution of crypto technology and how this move ultimately connects Web2 and Web3.

Highlights of the Insights

For Robinhood, there are several compelling reasons to choose to launch its own blockchain, one key point being MEV capture. This includes both MEV capture and fee capture - unique advantages brought by launching its own blockchain.

Whether it's issuing tokenized stocks on Arbitrum One or on Robinhood's own chain, this is the "ultimate prize" we truly look forward to. It's not just a matter of "launching another asset on-chain," but rather a deep integration of blockchain technology with existing Web 2 infrastructure.

Tokenizing stocks and introducing them to the blockchain market is indeed a completely new innovation. We need to deeply understand how to connect the dynamic relationship between traditional financial systems and blockchain. This is indeed a challenge, but we should not shy away from it.

Cryptographic technology will be at the core of the next financial revolution. We cannot remain stuck in past models; blockchain and cryptocurrencies will become the financial infrastructure of the future, and eventually everyone will adapt and move in this direction.

The technical issue of fragmented liquidity accounts for only 10%, while the real core is the 90% user experience (UX) and wallet support issues. Even with the most complex protocols, if wallets cannot simplify user operations and provide a unified environment for users, these technological innovations will not truly take effect.

Blockchain will integrate into our financial system and become a part of it. I believe that over time, this will become increasingly apparent, and blockchain will play a crucial role.

As blockchain technology gradually becomes mainstream and is widely accepted, institutions will realize that building on blockchain not only provides better services for users but also reduces costs and enhances profitability. This is a win-win choice.

It is very important to give users the choice of self-sovereignty, which means that users can transfer their assets to their own wallets at any time or choose other custody methods.

If you believe that the future of the crypto industry is only as we saw it a week ago, then you might think there is no need to develop L2. But in reality, the development of the industry requires greater capacity. The development plan for L2 is the only path that can meet future demands.

Through the development roadmap of L2, we can shift from a single L1 platform to a more decentralized and efficient L2 ecosystem. Although this process is not easy, once the interoperability issues are resolved, we can achieve long-term sustainable development.

Why did Robinhood choose Arbitrum, and how much control do they actually have?

Laura:

Welcome to the episode of "Unchained" on July 4, 2025. Today's guest is Steven Goldfetter, the co-founder and CEO of Off Chain Labs. Steven, it's a great pleasure to have you on the show.

The recent big news is that Robinhood announced the launch of perpetual contracts, tokenized stocks, and their own blockchain. This indicates that not only is the crypto industry pushing users on-chain, but other sectors are also beginning to realize the potential of blockchain technology and are gradually adopting it. Robinhood initially chose to launch on Arbitrum 1 while building their own chain using the Arbitrum technology stack, which is an important milestone for Arbitrum. There are rumors that Robinhood may have initially considered Solana but ultimately chose Arbitrum. So, Steven, can you share the main reasons behind Robinhood's decision?

Steven:

Robinhood's choices are primarily based on two key factors. The first is the maturity and security of the Arbitrum technology stack. Our technology has been stably running in production environments for years and can support the demands of enterprises the size of Robinhood.

The second is flexibility. Robinhood initially launched tokenized stocks and ETFs on Arbitrum 1, while announcing future migration to its own Arbitrum chain, namely the Robinhood chain. Arbitrum is the only ecosystem that has both a trusted neutral blockchain (such as Arbitrum 1) and offers a top-tier blockchain technology stack. This combination allows Robinhood to quickly launch while easily scaling to its own chain as demand grows, without needing major adjustments to its existing architecture.

Laura:

One of the attractions of the Arbitrum tech stack is that it allows enterprises to highly customize according to their needs. Can you elaborate on the customization options provided by Arbitrum Orbit?

Steven:

Of course. Customization is mainly divided into two categories: basic customization and advanced customization. Basic customization includes options that we directly support, such as the customization of gas tokens. Arbitrum 1 defaults to using Ethereum as the gas token, but users can choose to use stablecoins or their own tokens as gas tokens. Additionally, the data availability layer can also choose different solutions, such as Celestia.

Similarly, in terms of data availability layers, Arbitrum 1 uses Ethereum, which is the safest data availability layer. But we also support Celestia and many other data availability layers that are being launched.

These are basically two out-of-the-box customization examples. There are also some deeper customizations, such as block time; Arbitrum 1 has a block time of 250 milliseconds, but some chains (like Ray) operate at 100 milliseconds, and the technology is actually stable enough to support this. These are just parameters you can set.

Then there is what I call "deeper customization," where you actually need to go into the backend and change some things yourself. These methods may not be supported, but you are free to try.

For example, chains like Phoenix are building privacy directly into the Arbitrum technology stack. They use fully homomorphic encryption to enhance privacy in this case. There are also chains like Plume and Kaito that are adding institutional KYC controls at the chain level itself. Thus, you have an environment where everyone is subject to compliance checks upon entry. These are some examples.

In addition, some communities will enforce copyright fees, and if you want to transfer specific assets on the chain, there will be mandatory requirements. Many different customizations, but all use the core of Arbitrum technology.

How Arbitrum Stylus Provides a Better User Experience for Robinhood and Other Platforms

Laura:

Among the technical advantages of Arbitrum, there is a noteworthy product - Arbitrum Stylus. Could you introduce its features to us, and what problems it solves for enterprises that might encounter issues when using Arbitrum technology?

Steven:

Arbitrum Stylus is an innovative product we launched last September, which is very unique in the blockchain field, and there are currently no similar solutions in other ecosystems. The main feature of Stylus is that it allows developers to use traditional programming languages such as Rust and C++ on Arbitrum 1, rather than being limited to Solidity. This is very practical for developers, especially in scenarios that require high-performance computing, such as validating new signature schemes or zero-knowledge proofs. Rust and C++ are usually more efficient than Solidity, allowing developers to directly import code from these languages onto the chain for writing smart contracts.

In addition, the performance advantages of Stylus are very evident for complex computing tasks such as AI inference. According to our benchmarks, using Stylus for computations can typically achieve more than a 10-fold performance improvement while significantly reducing costs.

Another significant advantage of Stylus is its flexibility. Traditional blockchain development usually requires developers to make a choice between EVM chains and Rust chains in advance, and this choice will affect subsequent development work. On Arbitrum and any chain that supports Stylus, developers can use both EVM and other languages simultaneously, freely choosing the most suitable tools. In addition, contracts written in different languages can interact seamlessly, and developers do not even need to know what language a particular contract is written in. For example, an application can primarily be written in Solidity, but certain complex parts can be rewritten in Rust for improved efficiency.

It is very important to bring convenience to our developers through the seamless integration of these tools. When it comes to the convergence of Web 2 and Web 3, Web 2 developers often prefer these other languages. Therefore, we hope to have a single environment that can attract EVM developers who like Solidity, while also appealing to those Web 2 developers with years of experience in languages like Rust, C, or C++, who can now directly leverage these languages in their blockchain applications.

Laura:

I imagine companies like Robinhood that have a large amount of legacy code, and if they could easily integrate into the blockchain technology stack, it could significantly simplify system integration. This is also one of the attractions of Stylus, right?

Steven:

Although I cannot fully represent Robinhood in describing their specific technical implementation, it is certain that they are very interested in Stylus and consider it an important breakthrough. Moreover, Stylus provides a powerful tool for other developers, attracting them to build applications on the Robinhood chain. If Robinhood positions this chain as a leading platform for the tokenization of real-world assets (RWAs), many traditional brokerage firms may consider migrating to this chain, as these firms often have years of accumulated legacy code. The compatibility and flexibility of Stylus make this migration simpler, while also bringing more possibilities to the entire ecosystem.

Why is liquidity fragmentation still a significant unresolved issue?

Laura:

Do you think Arbitrum Stylus can help solve the long-standing problem of liquidity fragmentation? In decentralized finance (DeFi), liquidity fragmentation has been an unsolved challenge. If users need to interact with other chains, such as through bridging systems for interoperability, will Stylus be helpful in this regard?

Steven:

The fragmentation of liquidity is indeed an important issue, but I believe it is a somewhat different area. We must focus on solving this problem, and Option Labs is working in this direction with the goal of optimizing user experience, not only connecting all Arbitrum chains but also connecting all blockchains, especially EVM chains. This will allow users to interact across chains more easily while developers can also create shared experiences.

Stylus, as a toolkit, is helpful for anything you want to build on the blockchain, but I'm not sure if it's particularly beneficial for addressing the issue of liquidity fragmentation. The only advantage is that it allows you to verify zero-knowledge proofs (ZKP) on-chain. If bridging solutions need to utilize ZKP, which is often necessary, then there may be benefits in this regard.

Why is MEV capture so attractive for Robinhood?

Laura:

I believe there is another important factor that may be crucial for Robinhood, which is the control over MEV.

Steven:

If we compare two options: one is to operate on a public blockchain, and the other is to launch its own blockchain. For Robinhood, there are several compelling reasons to choose to launch its own blockchain, one of which is the key point of MEV capture.

MEV refers to the additional profits generated from the ordering of blockchain transactions, typically captured by miners or validators. If Robinhood were to operate on a public blockchain, their MEV profits would flow to others. Having their own blockchain allows them to have full control over MEV capture. This is very important. For example, they can use our recently launched Time Boost technology on Arbitrum One to optimize MEV capture or adopt other solutions developed by Dashboard. These specific technical choices will depend on their strategic planning. While I don't have more details to share today, it is certain that unique control over MEV can only be achieved on their own chain.

Another important reason is fee capture. If Robinhood operates on a public blockchain, they need to pay fees for every user transaction, which ultimately goes to others. However, if they launch their own blockchain, these fees can not only stay within their own system but also be converted into a source of income. In other words, Robinhood can not only reduce operational costs but also increase revenue by attracting more user transactions. This dual benefit—capturing MEV and capturing fees—is the unique advantage of launching their own blockchain.

Why on-chain stock tokenization could be the "ultimate prize" for Arbitrum.

Laura:

In a recent series of announcements from Robinhood, especially regarding the launch of the Robinhood chain, why do you say tokenized stocks are so appealing to your team?

Steven:

I think this is closely related to the Robinhood chain. Our stance on the relationship between Arbitrum and the Robinhood chain is relatively neutral, but the tokenized stock issuance within the entire Arbitrum ecosystem is what excites us the most. Whether it's on Arbitrum One or on Robinhood's own chain for tokenized stock issuance, I believe this is what we truly look forward to as the "ultimate prize." Let me share my personal experience and explain why I think this matter is so important.

Back in 2013, when I first encountered smart contracts, what truly excited me was not the emerging verticals like NFTs (although they are interesting too). What shocked me was the powerful potential of this technology to rebuild and transform existing systems. However, over the past decade, many people's understanding of this vision has become blurred, even forgotten, leading to cryptocurrency gradually being seen as an independent system rather than a tool for transforming the existing framework.

Robinhood's approach has given me hope for a return to the original intention of cryptocurrency. They are not simply launching a new crypto product; they are choosing to fundamentally reshape their core business. As Robinhood's CEO Vlad mentioned, they are "rebuilding" their core product. During the event, they showcased the user experience of the Robinhood app in the US and Europe. These two experiences look identical, and users may not even notice the difference. In fact, trades in the US are executed through traditional brokerage firms, while trades in Europe are conducted through the Arbitrum blockchain. This seamless transition in user experience is a significant breakthrough.

This is not just a matter of "launching another asset on-chain," but rather a deep integration of blockchain technology with the existing Web 2 infrastructure. Every user of the Robinhood app, whether they realize it or not, is able to access blockchain technology and cryptocurrencies. I believe that the potential of this approach is very powerful.

What does it mean to be part of the Arbitrum ecosystem?

Laura:

I believe that Robinhood's decision may be influenced by an important factor, which is the impressive performance of Arbitrum's total locked value (TVL). Its TVL is slightly higher than Base, with both being at similar levels. This makes me curious about what specific advantages Robinhood could gain from the existing Arbitrum ecosystem after launching its own chain on Arbitrum One.

Steven:

The liquidity you mentioned is key. Robinhood is a very powerful market participant, and I believe they will not encounter too many issues in driving liquidity on their own chain. However, for products like Robinhood, a deep liquidity network is indispensable. Arbitrum One just happens to provide them with this environment.

Looking to the future, even if these assets are eventually issued on the Robinhood chain, I believe they will still have a profound impact on the entire Arbitrum ecosystem. The reason is that the Arbitrum ecosystem is already very mature and strong in the DeFi space. In addition to crypto-native assets, traditional financial assets such as stocks and ETFs can now be introduced. These assets can be integrated into existing protocols to operate as part of them. Especially through on-chain stock tokenization, users can leverage these assets for activities such as collateralization and lending, which will fundamentally change the functionality and potential of the entire ecosystem.

This transformation will not only benefit the Arbitrum ecosystem but also impact the broader Ethereum ecosystem. The ability to issue these assets on-chain will significantly enhance the application scope of blockchain technology. I believe this innovation will continue to drive the development of Arbitrum One in both the short and long term.

How Stock Tokenization is Changing Investment Models and Its Potential Risks

Laura:

You may have seen Rob Hadick's tweet, or you may not have, as you might be busy with many other things. He mentioned that combining stocks with the DeFi world could have far-reaching implications, especially when these tokenized assets are used in different ways in DeFi. He also noted that this could raise some issues, such as the price of tokenized stocks possibly deviating from the price of their actual underlying assets.

After all, the traditional stock market does not allow for 24-hour trading all year round like the crypto market. What are your thoughts on this? What issues do people need to pay attention to in this process?

Steven:

Actually, I haven't seen his specific point of view, so I will answer from a more general perspective. If my response doesn't fully correspond to his argument, it's because I haven't seen his tweet.

First of all, as you mentioned, the trading hours in the traditional market are 5 days a week, 24 hours, rather than the year-round 24-hour trading model (247). Nevertheless, the traditional market does have an after-hours trading mechanism, but there is still significant room for improvement in overall efficiency. Deep liquidity and arbitrage opportunities are key factors in maintaining price consistency across different markets.

Of course, tokenizing stocks and introducing them to the blockchain market is indeed a brand new innovation. We need to deeply understand how to connect the dynamic relationship between the traditional financial system and blockchain. This is indeed a challenge, but we should not back down because of it.

In fact, the 24/7 trading model offers many benefits. For example, the redemption of traditional currency market funds usually requires a wait of 5 days, whereas on-chain stablecoins can achieve instant redemption. This is very important for large fund holders, as they can avoid losing interest income due to waiting.

Overall, stock tokenization will provide investors and ordinary users with a more convenient and efficient way to invest. Of course, there may be issues with price deviation in the short term, but this is because we are in a stage of technological breakthrough from nothing to something. As technology develops and the market matures, these issues will gradually be resolved.

Looking to the future, more and more assets will be issued directly on the blockchain. As Robinhood's CEO Vlad mentioned last week on CNBC, crypto technology will be at the core of the next financial revolution. From the initial paper and pen records to computerization, and now to encryption, each transition comes with certain friction. But we cannot remain stuck in past models. Blockchain and cryptocurrencies will become the financial infrastructure of the future, and I believe that eventually everyone will adapt and shift in this direction.

Why will Arbitrum DAO benefit from this cooperation?

Laura:

I have a question because such collaborative transactions usually involve financial aspects. Could you talk about whether there are any financial incentives in the partnership with Robinhood? Or could you share some related information?

Steven:

Due to policy restrictions, I cannot disclose the specific details of the collaboration. However, I can say that this partnership is very beneficial for both parties. It will not only help Robinhood expand its product range but also bring significant value to Arbitrum DAO. The DAO can enhance community building through these integrations while also gaining economic benefits from each launched project.

Fragmented liquidity is easier to solve than most people think.

Laura:

I want to return to the issue of liquidity fragmentation that we discussed earlier. As these areas converge, this issue may become more pronounced. Do you have any particular solutions that excite you? Or which aspects do you think need more attention? Overall, how do you think this issue will be resolved?

Steven:

This is a question I have been thinking about for a long time. Perhaps my viewpoint is somewhat controversial. Many people believe that liquidity fragmentation is a technical issue that can be resolved by technical teams designing complex protocols. However, I believe that the technical issue accounts for only 10%, while the real core is the 90% user experience (UX) and wallet support issues. Even with the most complex protocols, if wallets cannot simplify user operations and provide a unified environment for users, these technological innovations will not truly take effect.

Of course, we can also make more optimizations in the protocol design. There are currently some good protocols that can alleviate the problem of liquidity fragmentation, although they are not perfect yet, they can still drive the process forward. However, what really needs to be addressed is the enhancement of user experience. For example, the current experience of using blockchain is like an internet without a browser. Users need to input complex addresses to interact and complete various cumbersome operations, which is very unfriendly to ordinary users.

We are working hard to build a tool similar to a "browser" that simplifies the complexity of user interactions with the blockchain. For example, imagine if a window popped up on YouTube asking whether you wanted to watch through AWS or ECP today; this would make no sense to users. Users only care about the application experience, not the underlying technical details. Therefore, I believe redesigning the front-end experience is key to solving the problem, and it is also an achievable goal, but currently, no one has really taken action on it.

We are launching some preliminary solutions to drive this process, and we will release more relevant information in the coming weeks. By integrating existing resources and technologies, I believe we can address most of the challenges in the issue of liquidity fragmentation.

What direction will the integration of cryptocurrency and traditional finance take next?

Laura:

I think you might be participating in some very interesting conversations right now, even though you may not be able to reveal too many details. However, can you talk about the trends you've observed, or based on these conversations, which direction do you think the industry will head in the short term? We've noticed that many companies have recently started to enter the same field and compete, each approaching it from different angles and possibly with different advantages. At the same time, a long-held view by many is becoming a reality, which is the emergence of the "financial internet." I remember that someone mentioned some of the views you often speak about, possibly on Bankless. It seems we are witnessing this process in a slow manner, which may take ten years or even longer.

Based on your current observations, what do you think will happen in the short term? What are some interesting ways in which the two worlds might combine that ordinary people may not be aware of yet?

Steven:

First of all, I do often say this: I think there are some misconceptions in our use of terminology. For example, no one would say "I work in centralized finance," finance is just finance. And blockchain is not a marginalized technology that only a few people can access. It is actually a tool that can reconstruct the entire financial system, and ultimately it will be integrated into our financial system, becoming a part of it. I believe that over time, this will become increasingly evident, and blockchain will play a crucial role.

Entering this field is always difficult, as everyone is waiting for a pioneer to break the first barrier before others can follow suit. Therefore, we now see many smart individuals and large institutions saying, "I used to think this was impossible, but since they can do it, we can also give it a try." This is both a motivation and an observation of the actions of pioneers. At the same time, these institutions are also studying existing token standards, contemplating how to collaborate or reuse these technologies, and building open standards based on them. These are all important dialogues currently taking place in the industry. I believe that almost no large financial institution is without a team researching how to integrate blockchain technology now. The situation is completely different from five years ago, when you still needed to convince them that this was worth discussing, whereas now it is quite the opposite.

As the regulatory environment changes and significant measures are taken by forward-thinking companies like Robinhood, this provides a reference for the decision-making of other institutions. As the old saying goes, "No one was ever fired for choosing IBM." As blockchain technology gradually becomes mainstream and widely accepted, institutions will realize that building on blockchain not only provides better services for users but also reduces costs and enhances profitability. This is a win-win choice. Moreover, as the pioneers take action, others will feel more assured to join in.

In addition, there are some companies, such as BlackRock, Franklin Templeton, and WisdomTree, that have developed products on Arbitrum. As for what this means for the average user, returning to my earlier point, the most exciting aspect is that users no longer have to deal with complex technical details. For example, in the past, people might have thought that to use blockchain features on Robinhood, users needed to download a wallet, back up their mnemonic phrase, connect to an RPC server, and so on. But what we see today is that blockchain technology can serve both technical users and regular users, providing a more seamless experience.

I believe that it is very important to empower users with the choice of self-sovereignty, which means that users can transfer their assets to their own wallets at any time or choose other custody methods. This is a major core advantage of blockchain. However, I also do not think that the next billion users will use blockchain in the same cumbersome way as today. We need a more user-friendly experience to truly achieve this goal.

Defend Ethereum and criticize the opponents of L2

Laura:

Over the past year and a half, there has been a viewpoint that L2s like Arbitrum are "parasites" of Ethereum. While this statement may not be accepted by everyone, its core meaning is that L2s have siphoned off some value from the Ethereum main chain, such as transaction fees. At the same time, we have also seen that the "ultrasound money theory" has not fully realized its expected effects, and these changes are redefining the landscape of the industry.

What I want to ask is, during the recent event, AJ, Vitalik, and Johann appeared on stage together, and it seems that the Ethereum Foundation's attitude towards L2 is changing. So, what does this moment mean for the Ethereum community? What is the relationship between Ethereum and L2? Additionally, what is Vitalik's attitude towards DeFi?

Steven:

I believe that the core values of the Ethereum community will not be weakened as a result. In fact, I was one of the earliest people to publicly share relevant details and can tell you that Vitalik is very supportive of the current progress. His active participation in activities has demonstrated this. While I can't speak for him, based on my communications with him, he is very excited about the current industry developments and believes this is an important victory for Ethereum.

For those who question the relationship between L1 and L2, especially those who believe "Do we really need L2? Why not put all functionalities on L1?", I think their perspective may be too narrow. If you believe that the future of the crypto industry is merely the way we saw it a week ago, then you might feel that there's no need to develop L2. But in reality, the development of the industry requires greater capacity. Institutions are entering the blockchain space on a large scale and have already expanded to 32 countries globally, establishing core applications on this technology. We need a scalable solution, and the development plan for L2 is the only path that can meet future demands.

For example, if you build a new road on a congested single-lane highway, some might say, "Why build so many lanes? The traffic isn't that crowded now." But in reality, a new city is forming, and in the future, these lanes will be fully occupied. We cannot keep building new lanes every year; instead, we need a long-term solution. With the development roadmap of L2, we can transition from a singular L1 platform to a more decentralized and efficient L2 ecosystem. Although this process is not easy, once we solve the interoperability issues, we can achieve long-term sustainable development.

The Ethereum community has overcome this hurdle, and although there are still some issues to address, we have essentially built a foundation to support future development. For example, Robinhood recently chose Ethereum as the core platform for its blockchain technology and launched cryptocurrency trading features based on Arbitrum. This is not just my personal opinion; Robinhood has also made it clear that they chose Ethereum because it has the ecosystem most suitable for their business, and Arbitrum is the best technical solution to achieve this goal.